Widescreen Gaming Forum

I don't see why 1080p should be a hard and fast cap. However, I doubt it'll cope with triple 2560x1600 with 3D mode enabled. Because of bandwidth issues at 2560x1600 @120Hz...

Moreover we should keep in mind that 3D-graphics acceleration requires not only 120Hz but nearly double the horsepower on the GPUs. Since all frames have to be rendered twice one will need a Fermi quad-SLI or so to even run 3x30in fluently. But then there is mircostuttering which kills the gaming experience. I think 5760x1200 will be the sweet spot für 3dVS - still requiring serious High-End SLI-GPU-Power but doable.

In the end it might be that we will get a better 3D-experience by adding three smaller 1080p TVs to our rigs. We´ll see. Nvidia rumours are that Fermi cards will be in mass production in February - so we will know soon...

It's always about the cabling as a limitation. Just a wild guess but single-link DVI probably caps at 60hz 1920x1200 bandwidth and dual-link DVI probably caps at 120hz 1920x1200. In order to have the bandwidth for 120hz 1920x1200 is probably pushing the limits of dual-link DVI through a single cable.

Keep in mind that with the DH2G you could only push 2x 1920x1200 60hz max and the TH2G is 3x 1680x1050 57hz max. The cable bandwidth is an issue. My guess, because of cabling we probably won't see 2560x1600 120hz displays anytime soon.

_________________
Brad Hawthorne
Product Manager
Nthusim Pty. Ltd. | www.nthusim.com

[quote]

I don't see why 1080p should be a hard and fast cap. However, I doubt it'll cope with triple 2560x1600 with 3D mode enabled. Because of bandwidth issues at 2560x1600 @120Hz...

Moreover we should keep in mind that 3D-graphics acceleration requires not only 120Hz but nearly double the horsepower on the GPUs. Since all frames have to be rendered twice one will need a Fermi quad-SLI or so to even run 3x30in fluently. But then there is mircostuttering which kills the gaming experience. I think 5760x1200 will be the sweet spot für 3dVS - still requiring serious High-End SLI-GPU-Power but doable.

In the end it might be that we will get a better 3D-experience by adding three smaller 1080p TVs to our rigs. We´ll see. Nvidia rumours are that Fermi cards will be in mass production in February - so we will know soon...

It's always about the cabling as a limitation. Just a wild guess but single-link DVI probably caps at 60hz 1920x1200 bandwidth and dual-link DVI probably caps at 120hz 1920x1200. In order to have the bandwidth for 120hz 1920x1200 is probably pushing the limits of dual-link DVI through a single cable.

Keep in mind that with the DH2G you could only push 2x 1920x1200 60hz max and the TH2G is 3x 1680x1050 57hz max. The cable bandwidth is an issue. My guess, because of cabling we probably won't see 2560x1600 120hz displays anytime soon.

Yes, perhaps they have to cater to the lowest common denominator (cheap cables).

Well if NVidia makes the Jump to using DP 1.2 and if manufacturers would make 120Hz panels with them in place, we could easily have 2560x1600@120Hz.

I'm really in hope for DP 1.2 because the more bandwidth we have, the more we can do with it.

(Favorite Tool: "Bandwidth Calculator" http://emsai.net/projects/widescreen/bandwidth/)

_________________
System Core: | Intel Core i5-2500K + ASUS P8Z68-V + 16GB Corsair XMS3 DDR3 1333 MHz | Win7 x64 | MSI R7970 Lightning 3GB [1105/1400] |
Display: | 3 x Dell Ultrasharp 3007WFP-HC @ 7680x1600 | Dell u3011 |

Yes, perhaps they have to cater to the lowest common denominator (cheap cables).

It has nothing to do with expensive/cheap cables. It has to do with the bandwidth capabilities of any Dual-Link DVI cable... :wink:

You could run regular 2560x1600 LCDs just fine with this, but there won't be 120hz 2560x1600 LCDs until there is a cable that can feed them. Does DP 1.2 have enough bandwidth to do 120hz 2560x1600?

_________________
Brad Hawthorne
Product Manager
Nthusim Pty. Ltd. | www.nthusim.com

[quote]

Yes, perhaps they have to cater to the lowest common denominator (cheap cables).

It has nothing to do with expensive/cheap cables. It has to do with the bandwidth capabilities of any Dual-Link DVI cable... :wink:

You could run regular 2560x1600 LCDs just fine with this, but there won't be 120hz 2560x1600 LCDs until there is a cable that can feed them. Does DP 1.2 have enough bandwidth to do 120hz 2560x1600?

2560x1600@120Hz = 11.8 Gbit of Bandwidth Required
DisplayPort v1.2 = 17.28 Gbit

I'd say so.

DP1.2 has enough bandwidth to Run 3x2560x1440@60Hz

EDIT: Fixed Some Numbers That were off.

_________________
System Core: | Intel Core i5-2500K + ASUS P8Z68-V + 16GB Corsair XMS3 DDR3 1333 MHz | Win7 x64 | MSI R7970 Lightning 3GB [1105/1400] |
Display: | 3 x Dell Ultrasharp 3007WFP-HC @ 7680x1600 | Dell u3011 |

More bandwidth is good, yes... but I believe it unlikely to see this as it seems NVidia is contempt to stay with dvi and hdmi.

_________________
Professional... well I'll figure that out.



"I sense something, a presence I've not felt since......."

Hate to bump a 2 month old thread, but I have a few questions too. I did a bit of digging but I'm still a little unsure on some of it.

I have a 295 GTX, and I want to do surround gaming with Nvidia's new surround technology, which to my understand the drivers for which are still not out(?).

On this page (http://www.nvidia.com/object/3DV_System_Requirements_Surround_Technology.html) it says Single Card - GeForce GTX 295. So I'm assuming I don't need a 2nd card to use surround SLi, but that leaves the obvious issue that I'm well, short a DVI output for 3 monitors. So would I need to get some sort of splitter where I connect 2 monitors to 1 DVI port (if there is such a thing) or do I get a 2nd card setup as a dedicated PhysX card? Or..? :-S

Also, I'm currently using 4 monitors, 3 monitors for gaming, setup as one single monitor with the Matrox TH2GO, then a second monitor which I have above the other 3 (see my avatar :P) and I use it for auxiliary things, such as monitoring ventrilo, or having a guide or something up so I can look at it while playing a game, amongst other useful things. Will I be able to do the same thing with Nvidia's surround solution? To clarify - I don't want to play the game across 4 monitors, just 3 - I want to have a 4th separate monitor that acts independently from the first 3.

Hate to bump a 2 month old thread, but I have a few questions too. I did a bit of digging but I'm still a little unsure on some of it.

I have a 295 GTX, and I want to do surround gaming with Nvidia's new surround technology, which to my understand the drivers for which are still not out(?).

On this page (http://www.nvidia.com/object/3DV_System_Requirements_Surround_Technology.html) it says Single Card - GeForce GTX 295. So I'm assuming I don't need a 2nd card to use surround SLi, but that leaves the obvious issue that I'm well, short a DVI output for 3 monitors. So would I need to get some sort of splitter where I connect 2 monitors to 1 DVI port (if there is such a thing) or do I get a 2nd card setup as a dedicated PhysX card? Or..? :-S

Also, I'm currently using 4 monitors, 3 monitors for gaming, setup as one single monitor with the Matrox TH2GO, then a second monitor which I have above the other 3 (see my avatar :P) and I use it for auxiliary things, such as monitoring ventrilo, or having a guide or something up so I can look at it while playing a game, amongst other useful things. Will I be able to do the same thing with Nvidia's surround solution? To clarify - I don't want to play the game across 4 monitors, just 3 - I want to have a 4th separate monitor that acts independently from the first 3.

You would use 2 DVI and 1 HDMI to get your three displays. You may need an HDMI to DVI cable/converter (http://www.monoprice.com = http://www.monoprice.com/products/subdepartment.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10231 <-- I have these and they work great). There are no splitters involved. I guess that also answers your next question. No, you will not be able to use a 4th monitor with that setup. You would need to install a second card (unless you have onboard video you could get working as well).

And FYI, NVidia said drivers would likely be out in "mid-May or when they are ready." So who knows how long that could be. I wouldn't hold your breath.

[quote]Hate to bump a 2 month old thread, but I have a few questions too. I did a bit of digging but I'm still a little unsure on some of it.

I have a 295 GTX, and I want to do surround gaming with Nvidia's new surround technology, which to my understand the drivers for which are still not out(?).

On this page (http://www.nvidia.com/object/3DV_System_Requirements_Surround_Technology.html) it says Single Card - GeForce GTX 295. So I'm assuming I don't need a 2nd card to use surround SLi, but that leaves the obvious issue that I'm well, short a DVI output for 3 monitors. So would I need to get some sort of splitter where I connect 2 monitors to 1 DVI port (if there is such a thing) or do I get a 2nd card setup as a dedicated PhysX card? Or..? :-S

Also, I'm currently using 4 monitors, 3 monitors for gaming, setup as one single monitor with the Matrox TH2GO, then a second monitor which I have above the other 3 (see my avatar :P) and I use it for auxiliary things, such as monitoring ventrilo, or having a guide or something up so I can look at it while playing a game, amongst other useful things. Will I be able to do the same thing with Nvidia's surround solution? To clarify - I don't want to play the game across 4 monitors, just 3 - I want to have a 4th separate monitor that acts independently from the first 3.

You would use 2 DVI and 1 HDMI to get your three displays. You may need an HDMI to DVI cable/converter (http://www.monoprice.com = http://www.monoprice.com/products/subdepartment.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10231 <-- I have these and they work great). There are no splitters involved. I guess that also answers your next question. No, you will not be able to use a 4th monitor with that setup. You would need to install a second card (unless you have onboard video you could get working as well).

And FYI, NVidia said drivers would likely be out in "mid-May or when they are ready." So who knows how long that could be. I wouldn't hold your breath.

Thank you for the response! However, I appear to have a problem - there is no HDMI port on the back of my video card.. Only 2 DVI ports. I'm using EVGA GTX 295 Co-op Edition (as seen in this article : http://www.evga.com/articles/00478/), which I guess I failed to mention in my first post. I notice the non co-op edition cards did have an HDMI port.. Does this mean that the co-op edition cards cannot do surround gaming? If this is the case, this is incredibly disappointing.. Also, I'm having trouble finding these cards on Newegg or Tigerdirect.. did they stop manufacturing them or something?

[quote][quote]Hate to bump a 2 month old thread, but I have a few questions too. I did a bit of digging but I'm still a little unsure on some of it.

I have a 295 GTX, and I want to do surround gaming with Nvidia's new surround technology, which to my understand the drivers for which are still not out(?).

On this page (http://www.nvidia.com/object/3DV_System_Requirements_Surround_Technology.html) it says Single Card - GeForce GTX 295. So I'm assuming I don't need a 2nd card to use surround SLi, but that leaves the obvious issue that I'm well, short a DVI output for 3 monitors. So would I need to get some sort of splitter where I connect 2 monitors to 1 DVI port (if there is such a thing) or do I get a 2nd card setup as a dedicated PhysX card? Or..? :-S

Also, I'm currently using 4 monitors, 3 monitors for gaming, setup as one single monitor with the Matrox TH2GO, then a second monitor which I have above the other 3 (see my avatar :P) and I use it for auxiliary things, such as monitoring ventrilo, or having a guide or something up so I can look at it while playing a game, amongst other useful things. Will I be able to do the same thing with Nvidia's surround solution? To clarify - I don't want to play the game across 4 monitors, just 3 - I want to have a 4th separate monitor that acts independently from the first 3.

You would use 2 DVI and 1 HDMI to get your three displays. You may need an HDMI to DVI cable/converter (http://www.monoprice.com = http://www.monoprice.com/products/subdepartment.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10231 <-- I have these and they work great). There are no splitters involved. I guess that also answers your next question. No, you will not be able to use a 4th monitor with that setup. You would need to install a second card (unless you have onboard video you could get working as well).

And FYI, NVidia said drivers would likely be out in "mid-May or when they are ready." So who knows how long that could be. I wouldn't hold your breath.

Thank you for the response! However, I appear to have a problem - there is no HDMI port on the back of my video card.. Only 2 DVI ports. I'm using EVGA GTX 295 Co-op Edition (as seen in this article : http://www.evga.com/articles/00478/), which I guess I failed to mention in my first post. I notice the non co-op edition cards did have an HDMI port.. Does this mean that the co-op edition cards cannot do surround gaming? If this is the case, this is incredibly disappointing.. Also, I'm having trouble finding these cards on Newegg or Tigerdirect.. did they stop manufacturing them or something?

"Does this mean that the co-op edition cards cannot do surround gaming?"

I believe that is correct. I do recall that some GTX 295s have the HDMI port and some don't :doh . Also, EVGA has stopped making several of their GTX 2xx series cards (http://www.evga.com/products/prodlist.asp?family=GeForce+200+Series+Family). And as far as I can tell they have stopped making all GTX 295 cards. Ebay may be the only option at this point. Although, maybe because of the rarity, the 295 co-op seems to be selling for quite a bit these days ($350 - $450 on Ebay). So you may be able to just sell that and pick up a 295 with HDMI or two GTX 470s or a combination of GTX 2xx cards. Any SLI combination of GTX 260 or above should give you similar or better performance than the 295 (http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/gaming-graphics-cards-charts-2009-high-quality/Sum-of-FPS-Benchmarks-Totals,1830.html).